Quit your belly aching

CALLUS · Veteran Member

RE: Quit your belly aching

Elee · Veteran Member

Callus---No I don't know, all I know is I am not ready to be taxed anywhere any more than I already am. I am swimming in tax and rising prices. I get a raise they raise taxes or the price of milk, gas,ect.....And now they want to build a new athletic stadium. I say those who want that, had better start having some car washes and bake sales. I don't know where the book is that says a child has to have "football" to give him/her an education. Sorry if there will be those who are offended but you send your children to school to educate them. Not make college football scholarships for some of them. I don't want to pay for a foot ball stadium...period....Or pay special tax at Lowe's. They have nickled and dimed me to death. I have no idea about spikes or dips, all I know is, if they bring these new "big box" stores in, it will hurt the existing stores. Some more than others, but it will hurt them. Village Market is proof. Just my opinion.

numbers76 · Member

Good post Grant, I think the new retail devlopment could well make Ark City a regional trading center such as Ponca City or Salina. This could actually be a positive for existing retailers with more traffic into the community. I also believe this is an opportunity that Ark City Commission can and should support. It's not 1958 any more and we need to move into the 21st century.

Elee · Veteran Member

Numbers72 wrote:Good post Grant, I think the new retail devlopment could well make Ark City a regional trading center such as Ponca City or Salina. This could actually be a positive for existing retailers with more traffic into the community. I also believe this is an opportunity that Ark City Commission can and should support. It's not 1958 any more and we need to move into the 21st century.
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So glad you could share your opinion with us, although I don't believe you share the popular opinion. Of course that is yet to be seen. What I would like to say is I do realize this is not 1958, and I believe we all know that, things were different then. In 1958 a man could go to work in a factory that was a good solid factory and not have to worry about beind downsized. He could retire from the company he went to work for in thirty to forty years and spend all that time at one company. Times have changed Numbers76, yes, times have changed. Will getting an Applebees get the local residents more good jobs or will it make more $7 jobs just like we have already in this county. I guess if the 21st century consists of no middle class then it has been here for a while now. We have been living it for a few years.
We have no middle class, I was once told by a person who had no idea about how expensive the new name brand medicines he was prescribing was, he said in casual conversation, the middle class made about $80 to $100 thousand. I was taken back by his lack of understanding of what the rest of the world brought home in their paychecks, retirement checks, social security checks. So I got online and looked to see just what the middle class standards are, google it sometime. I would say that most people on a single pay check, or some with two pay checks coming in are upper lower class. The line between the rich and the poor keeps getting bigger.
Would a big box store benifit the area? Maybe. Has the city of AC been able to supply the people they have annexed in the past with sewer and other needs? Maybe some, most no. Do we want to help the big box store (who you already say will be a huge success) pay some tax (to build parking lots, sewer, water, ect...) to be here so they can make a bigger profit? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. If those annexed out west of the city have no access to the city sewer system, why can't those citizens get the updates they deserve instead of allowing those who can afford it to come in and dictate what the plan has to be to locate here.
I am not trying to slam the current city commission in any way by this annexation comment as most have inherited this situation. And most know the burden they have on their shoulders to take care of the people in their city as best they can, but there are those who would spend when there is no money, and put the burden on the taxpayers to bail them out. Some may say it is just a smidge of a tax, then someone else comes along with "just a smidge more" and "more" and "more". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that with lower paychecks and higher taxes, the burden is on the citizens.
If any of my information is wrong please enlighten me. If it isn't please understand the plight of the "upper lower class", the supporting tax payers.

Elee · Veteran Member

Quit your belly aching

LETTER to the EDITOR

Are you finally getting tired of the whining?

The city is again showing signs of growth and with the new businesses coming in it will bring more prosperity to those businesses already established.

It is a proven fact that if people do not go to other towns and cities to buy from a home improvement store and buy here in Ark City it will bring in more people to shop at other stores, too.

It is a proven fact where in some surveys the hardware stores in the towns with a large home improvement store have improved their business over 27 percent.

It is a proven fact that people will come into Ark City from outlying towns and even cities to shop at the home improvement store and will not only shop at that store but they will bring in revenue to our city.

The last thing about this subject is having new businesses will create jobs and most of the money earned on the jobs will stay in the city and will also go toward taxes.

What made these new businesses come into town?

Do you think it might have been our city has shown life again and new growth?

Do you think they see life again from a city that was very tired?

So, my friends and neighbors, quit whining about our town and just try to understand the progress.

I don't think the new businesses came to town to see us parking in our front yards, raising chickens in the city limits or that we have to have a license to prove our maintenance work went along with city codes.

I have heard complaints about the flower pots and the street improvements, but when I drive by those people's residences I see unkempt lawns and gardens with an occasional junk car in the back yard.

Instead of complaining, try to promote our city and even though there are still many things to do, be happy things are changing for the better.

Lastly, I was at the Veterans parade and felt a great deal of pride as we honored the veterans of the military as the members of the parade marched down our wonderful new main street.

After the parade I went to the bean feed at the American Legion where the organization honored the veterans with food and fellowship.

I was sitting at a table behind some of the old veterans from the Veterans Home in Winfield when a young girl perhaps 10 years old came up to the table and sang "It's a Grand Old Flag" for the older men.

It brought tears to my eyes, as how much my father who died in World War II, would have appreciated the honor by the youth as the little girl sang and others little girls sold poppies for the veterans causes.

God bless our youth and let us hope they will continue to be patriotic and such good citizens.

Grant Williams
Arkansas City

I was told once that WHINING is nothing but anger released a little bit at a time. I wonder if this is true? There will always be those who oppose most anything on the table. But if there were never any opposition things would go one way and only one way. Every one has the right to voice their opinion, whether it be the pots on main street, or tax breaks for new stores coming to town. Yes, we all see there is change coming. Some for the better, some maybe not. For years I had made the Village Market my main meat market, and bought many things on sale there as well. Look what we had to give up for progress. And those who worked there, had to go out of town for work. I know of one for sure who did. I personally have had to change my shopping habits to accomidate the loss of the Village Market. So yes, these stores may bring those in who may hire, but they will also run some out who hired, and have for years. Nothing ever stays the same, I will have to agree. But before we are quick to judge those who state their opinion, its best to hear what they have to say. Whether we agree or not.
I didn't get to attend the Vet's day parade but every one of them have fought to give us freedom and to have the right to freedom of speach. Even though some may think it is WHINING...........We will yet see what a wonderful asset these new stores will be to our town. And pray the exisiting stores in direct compatition will survive.

Patrick · Senior Member

Elee wrote:

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So glad you could share your opinion with us, although I don't believe you share the popular opinion. Of course that is yet to be seen. What I would like to say is I do realize this is not 1958, and I believe we all know that, things were different then. In 1958 a man could go to work in a factory that was a good solid factory and not have to worry about beind downsized. He could retire from the company he went to work for in thirty to forty years and spend all that time at one company. Times have changed Numbers76, yes, times have changed. Will getting an Applebees get the local residents more good jobs or will it make more $7 jobs just like we have already in this county. I guess if the 21st century consists of no middle class then it has been here for a while now. We have been living it for a few years.
We have no middle class, I was once told by a person who had no idea about how expensive the new name brand medicines he was prescribing was, he said in casual conversation, the middle class made about $80 to $100 thousand. I was taken back by his lack of understanding of what the rest of the world brought home in their paychecks, retirement checks, social security checks. So I got online and looked to see just what the middle class standards are, google it sometime. I would say that most people on a single pay check, or some with two pay checks coming in are upper lower class. The line between the rich and the poor keeps getting bigger.
Would a big box store benifit the area? Maybe. Has the city of AC been able to supply the people they have annexed in the past with sewer and other needs? Maybe some, most no. Do we want to help the big box store (who you already say will be a huge success) pay some tax (to build parking lots, sewer, water, ect...) to be here so they can make a bigger profit? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. If those annexed out west of the city have no access to the city sewer system, why can't those citizens get the updates they deserve instead of allowing those who can afford it to come in and dictate what the plan has to be to locate here.
I am not trying to slam the current city commission in any way by this annexation comment as most have inherited this situation. And most know the burden they have on their shoulders to take care of the people in their city as best they can, but there are those who would spend when there is no money, and put the burden on the taxpayers to bail them out. Some may say it is just a smidge of a tax, then someone else comes along with "just a smidge more" and "more" and "more". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that with lower paychecks and higher taxes, the burden is on the citizens.
If any of my information is wrong please enlighten me. If it isn't please understand the plight of the "upper lower class", the supporting tax payers.

Elee,

I can understand your confusion. There are a LOT of rumors out there and most of them wrong. The fact is that the developer will gain the tax advantage for the whole property. The "home improvement anchor" will buy a small piece of the property from the developer to build their store on. The "home improvement anchor" will have to pay all of its taxes plus be charging an additional 1% sales tax. All of the taxed revenues from this "home improvement anchor" and the "junior anchor" next to it will be redirected to pay for the developer's expenses through the TIF and TDD. If these businesses do not come in and provide the funds this development won't happen.

The developer is asking for these funds for 2 reasons. The first is to draw these retailers to their site rather than to anywhere else in the county. The second reason is to develope a full shopping center. The future smaller stores don't have the deep pockets that the "home impovement anchor" does, so basically it will be supporting the rest of the businesses, by being a big name to attract them, and also by paying enough taxes to bring the new construction into an affordable and attractive range for the future retailers.

It is true that the developers are in this to make money. And if they draw in the smaller retailers I'm sure they will do very well. The developers are the ones to gain by the TIF and TDD.

I'm not sure I understand the idea of more and more taxes. This project will only be funded by the NEW taxes this development generates. None of the existing city revenues will be involved. The city will not even be financing this. The developers have will have to get their own bond to pay for it. The best part is that the city will be collection some of the property taxes the whole time, then all of the taxes once the improvements are paid off.

Annexing the property has already put it on the tax rolls, and the city will start collecting property taxes. If the development comes in the city will still get this part of the taxes. Only the taxes on the improvements and the sales taxes will be used to pay off the TIF. There will be no cost or obligation to the city or the citizens. Nothing that we have at present will be affected, except that the city will be receiving a little more property tax from the annexed property, and hopefully, in the future, a lot more property tax and sales tax revenues.

I'm not sure I have answered properly, but I hope this helps.

As far as the sewer needs to the west of the city, if you could give me more information I would be glad to look into it. You are always welcome to email me directly at pmcdonald2005@sbcglobal.net

Patrick

Elee · Veteran Member

Patrick,No need to email you directly, I believe this is a question that all of us would like to know. Has the city already provided all services for all of those who have been annexed in past years? These services such as sewer, water, trash, police protection? I ask this not necessarily just for the west side people but for all people annexed in recent years. This would take care of some questions I have in my mind. Thank you in advance for your information.

Patrick · Senior Member

Elee wrote:

Patrick,No need to email you directly, I believe this is a question that all of us would like to know. Has the city already provided all services for all of those who have been annexed in past years? These services such as sewer, water, trash, police protection? I ask this not necessarily just for the west side people but for all people annexed in recent years. This would take care of some questions I have in my mind. Thank you in advance for your information.

Elee, I wish I could tell you that I have all that information at hand, but I'm afraid I don't. I am not even sure of all of the different areas that have been annexed in the past 10 years. I don't even have the information about which annexations were voluntary and which were not.

I would think that Police, Fire, and Trash would just be a matter of routing and those things would come about almost immediately. It could also be that depending on location some annexed areas may have a choice of services. I don't know.

Water is a long process that can take years (and a great deal of city dollars). In most cases water has been provided by another service. The city has to contract with that service in preparation to buy out existing equipment (and service). Planning must be done to attach these services to the city, and unattach from the previous provider. Upgrades may have to be done for pressure and other issues including fire hydrants among others. I don't think the city could even begin the engineering on this until after the annexation. I understand that the whole process can take several years.

Sewer is different from all the rest. People are not always required to attach to sewer. Situations that come to mind (though not in every case) are properties that already have a septic tank, the size of the property, location, and other factors.

If you have a specific location in mind I would be happy to gather the information for you. Unfortunately there have been so many on 3 sides (west, north, and east) and each has had its own set of circumstances.

If you do need information on a specific area the best place I can think of to get the information is Building, Planning & Codes upstairs at City Hall or call 441-4420.